SPEAKER_02: 0:04

Hi, I've been expecting you. Come in, sit down, make yourself comfortable. We're just about to start the show.

SPEAKER_03: 0:15

Here we are, back again to talk about Flaming Pie by Paul McCartney, the Paul McCartney album from 1997. So I'm going to kick off. Bernardo, I know that you have a history with this album, and I'm also going to ask you, how old were you when it came

SPEAKER_01: 0:34

out? I must have been about 14 when it came out.

SPEAKER_03: 0:37

That's perfect.

SPEAKER_01: 0:40

Yeah, yeah. I remember getting so excited because it also sounded so fresh to me, you know? So it's one of those Paul McCartney albums that I loved from the beginning. I think it was maybe one of the first Paul McCartney albums that I got that was released kind of at the time when I got it.

SPEAKER_03: 0:58

Does that make any sense? Yeah, so it's your Paul McCartney album, right?

SPEAKER_01: 1:02

Yeah. Because I think the album he'd released before this one was Off the Ground. That's right. And I remember seeing the video of Hope of Deliverance all the time on TV. But I didn't have that album. And I wasn't that interested in music at that time. So it wasn't until 97 that I got this one. And I thought it was a great album. It sounded completely different as well to Off the Ground, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_03: 1:27

It does sound fresh, doesn't it? It sounds fresh and sort of a bit stripped down. Not completely, but just because there's a huge emphasis on guitars on this album, a lot of arpeggiated guitar playing, and less fussiness. I mean, I think that they recorded some of the tracks quite quickly, and so there's less fussiness about the production and everything like that. So it still sounds... fresh today it doesn't sound like it's stuck in the 90s or anything

SPEAKER_01: 1:59

yeah and a few of the songs were written in the 80s as well um for a project that never um that was never released called return to pepperland i don't know if you've heard about that um i've

SPEAKER_03: 2:12

heard about it but i don't i haven't heard much from it if anything there's probably possibly a song called return to pepperland which I don't remember, but I think I've heard that one.

SPEAKER_01: 2:22

Yeah, he did some sessions with Phil Ramone and they recorded Beautiful Night. So there is an 80s version of Beautiful Night. I think they recorded a version of this one as well with Paul on the piano, which is very different to the version on Flowers in the Dirt. A bunch of things from Flowers in the Dirt we're recording here. And I think the only song from Flaming Pie was Beautiful Night and some B-sides as well.

SPEAKER_03: 2:49

Ah, okay. Well, you know, when this album came out I missed it. I have to admit, like, I'd sort of lost my faith in Paul. What? I don't know if this is it. Well, yeah, I know. The thing was, I saw him in 94, and it was very good, and I really enjoyed the gig, and that was my first time seeing Paul. And then, of course, the album was Off the Ground. I mean, I loved Hope of Deliverance. I still think that's an excellent song. But all, you know, stuff like Biker, like an icon and stuff, I hate to be critical, but I just thought, you know, And I didn't get that album and I hadn't got press to play. I had got Flowers in the Dirt. So, you know, there was so much. I was living in London. There was a lot of not just Brit pop, obviously heavily influenced. We can come to that later. But there was the Brit pop era in London and the Beatles anthology era. And I was caught up in that and a lot of the dance music and everything at the time. And, you know, I just thought, because, you know, the picture on the cover is kind of a bit cadaverous. It is. It's not the best picture. No, he looked so old and worn. And I just thought, you know what? I'm going to skip it. And I did not hear... I mean, I heard a couple of tracks, obviously, in the intervening years, because... Do you remember those open... You could get all those free downloads and everything. So I got a couple of tracks, but I didn't hear the whole album until the archive release, which was something like 2020 or 2021. It was 2020,

SPEAKER_01: 4:27

and it was the last archive to be released as well. That's right. They haven't released

SPEAKER_03: 4:31

one since... And it was right in the middle of all the lockdown and everything. And that's when I first got to know this Paul McCartney album. So it's been nice coming back to it here because I really, yeah, I didn't, I mean, it's like it was new to me. I didn't know it well.

SPEAKER_01: 4:49

Yeah, you can tell that this album came as a result of the Beatles Anthology project that they did back in 95, not just because of the kind of Beatle-like production, but also because he did a lot of things with Jeff Lynne. He co-produced a few of the tracks.

SPEAKER_03: 5:06

Yeah, so Jeff Lynne was hanging around, wasn't he? And then he obviously, I'm not sure why he decided to enlist Steve Miller as well. I think it was because they'd done one of the tracks before and then yeah he was going back to a track that he and Steve Miller had recorded in 1969 I think so they booked this session and they recorded I think four four tracks for this so so I mean it's always interesting because with a lot of these later McCartney albums there's a key collaborator or one or two maybe a producer or an extra musician who's lifting a A lot of the load, you know, and just I think Paul likes collaborating with people and sharing their talents.

SPEAKER_01: 5:50

I think so, too. But the other thing I like about this album is that other than Steve Miller and Jeff Lynne, I think he played all the instruments in most songs.

SPEAKER_03: 5:58

Yeah, that's right. Paul is drumming away there.

SPEAKER_01: 6:02

Yeah. And you can tell that there is some magic when Paul does all the production that he doesn't have when he uses his bands. And I say bands because I'm talking about the one from off the ground or his current band.

SPEAKER_03: 6:17

Yeah, his style of drumming is quite distinctive. Yeah. Interestingly, for a lot of these songs, the drums are missed out completely. Even, I think, the opening track, Songs We Were Singing, has no drums. So, yeah, that's got a nice, fresh feel when there are no drums as well. I think that's got quite a Beatle-y feel sometimes for some of these acoustic-y tracks.

SPEAKER_01: 6:45

Yeah. Yeah. That's true. But then when he does play the drums, like in the second track, it's great.

SPEAKER_03: 6:55

Yeah, yeah, yeah. He can really play. When this album came out, I did hear the single Young Boy, which I like. Rolling Stone gave it four stars, calling it his most satisfying record in years. All Music have recently called it an album that ranks among his very best solo work. And Q Magazine described it as an album of considerable charm. And I feel that. I feel it's very charming. And I know something you said to me, I remember you said to me a little while ago that it was the last chance to hear Young Paul.

SPEAKER_01: 7:33

Yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_03: 7:35

I think it's true. Yeah, it's a kind of a bridge between... His mid period and his late period, let's say.

SPEAKER_01: 7:43

Yeah, because after this album, Linda sadly passed away. And then he didn't play for a couple of years. And I think it wasn't until Run Devil Run that he started playing again.

SPEAKER_03: 7:54

That's right. Yeah. That's right. Yeah, I remember. I remember I did get Run Devil Run when it came out. Yeah, that's one we could do. Yeah. So

SPEAKER_01: 8:03

something interesting. Really good album. Yeah. Yes, something interesting about this album is that while they were working on the Beatles anthology project, Paul was asked not to release anything. So he didn't really work on any music. And he did this radio show called Ubu Jubu, which came, like some bits of it were released as singles. And I think if you got the deluxe version of the archive collection, then there are certain bits from Ubu Jubu. that you can hear. But in reality, it was an eight-part radio program. And

SPEAKER_03: 8:37

it's got some sort of experimental Paul McCartney music on it,

SPEAKER_01: 8:42

doesn't it? It does, and some B-sides and some reggae that he found in Jamaica, and he plays some songs that he likes, and there are some funny bits as well. So

SPEAKER_03: 8:52

where did this go out?

SPEAKER_01: 8:53

Where was it broadcast, do you know? Or was it broadcast? It was broadcast. I can't remember. It was broadcast in America. I can't remember the name of the radio station. Okay. And then it was released as a bootleg. Right, which you kindly gave me. Yeah, it's really good. So there is one part that I really find funny. And as you know, Paul was promoting being a vegetarian very heavily. So he got Little Richard to do a little spot. And I think it's really funny. Would you mind if I played it? It's only a few seconds. No,

SPEAKER_03: 9:26

let's hear it.

SPEAKER_00: 9:27

Hi, this is Little Richard. You know, I'm a vegetarian. I've been a vegetarian for many, many years. I don't eat any meat, fish, chicken, duck, nothing. Many people think that it is man's nature to eat meat, and that we are biologically inclined to do so from birth. I think that that's nonsense. But if you disagree with me, try this simple little test. You will need one child and one apple. Oh, that's good. I know, it's brilliant, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, that's really

SPEAKER_04: 10:11

nice.

SPEAKER_01: 10:17

And it had some other good bits. Linda had a little spot where she would give a recipe called Cook of the House. Ah, wow. So that's really cool. And then Paul worked on a lot of jingles for Ubu Jubu. I'll play the main theme. So I don't know if you've heard it before. Oh, let's hear

SPEAKER_03: 10:38

it. I have, but I've forgotten. Let's hear it.

UNKNOWN: 10:42

Let's hear it.

SPEAKER_01: 11:41

So it's just a jingle.

SPEAKER_03: 11:43

Ah, that's great. You know, something about Paul, I've forgotten who said, I think it was youth when he was collaborating on The Fireman, who said that Paul's got, you know, a dark side by which he means... playful side like yeah there's a relaxed side and when he's not thinking about it when he's just doing stuff like that I think sometimes that's when he's at his best you know when he's just doing the off-the-cuff stuff like the humorous codas we get some of that on this album yeah the little sketches I've always liked that that obviously starts with the Beatles and you know I think he should do more of that you know I know the fireman later on he was pushing himself to do more of that And, of course, McCartney 3 is a little bit more experimental. I think he needs to sort of lose the monitor or lose the critic and just put out stuff like

SPEAKER_01: 12:38

that. I know. It's so much fun. The radio station was Westwood 1, and it was 15 episodes. Right. Ah, wow. Yeah, so long. So, yes, it was long. So it was great. Can you imagine if he did it again? I'd certainly listen to it.

SPEAKER_03: 12:52

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01: 12:54

So let's get into some of the songs. Yeah, let's talk about the songs. you can go first um how about um side one track one the songs we were singing okay yeah a lovely track to open with what do you think of this i i like it very much i mean as you said he does lots of arpeggios um and this is one of the first songs that well it's the first song that has one yes on on the album it's very strange because it doesn't seem to have a middle eight It's only like verse, chorus, verse, chorus. And I was listening to another podcast about Flaming Pie. And the guy said that it's one of those songs that he feels he's supposed to like, but he doesn't quite like of Paul's. Oh. Yeah. I disagree with him. I think it's a beautiful song. I assume it's a song about John.

SPEAKER_03: 13:41

Yes. Yeah, I think so. I think it's about them riding together in Portland Road. Yeah. in Liverpool. And Paul plays Elvis's double bass on this, which is nice. I don't know if that's the first time that he played that. I don't know when he got it. You might know. So he's playing, as well as many other instruments, he's playing Elvis's double bass.

SPEAKER_01: 14:01

Yeah. And I like the words he uses, intricacies

SPEAKER_03: 14:05

of life. I love that and the cosmic solution and everything and I like the fact that it doesn't scan you know because Paul's usually quite strict about scanning the lyrics and in this case it's got the prosody right of regular speech it just sounds like he's speaking to you and he's not so bothered about the syllable count so he's letting himself off the leash there also that back falsetto which is on the demo you know but again he He's letting himself off the leash because normally he would have probably cut that out and maybe pruned the lyrics or something. So it's the announcement that the album is going to be a little bit more off the cuff. And like I said, I like the fact that it has no drums because it rocks when the chorus comes along and there's all the guitars in the back, but no drums. I think it's lovely.

SPEAKER_01: 15:03

And I like the ending as well. Uh-huh. One second.

SPEAKER_02: 15:35

So the ending

SPEAKER_01: 16:04

It just sounds more excited. Yeah, it sounds like he's very excited. Yeah. Let me see. Here.

UNKNOWN: 16:13

Here.

SPEAKER_01: 16:39

So I really like that part.

SPEAKER_03: 16:42

It's exuberant, isn't it? And it's a real grower. I mean, it's not the strongest one on the album, but it's a great one to open with because it references The Beatles and what he was thinking about the anthology. You know, the whole idea that he wants on the sleeve notes is that the anthology had got him sort of, you know, pulling his socks up and thinking, right, we had really high standards then. I'm going to do it now. And, you know, this song's a real celebration.

SPEAKER_01: 17:12

Yeah. And Jeff Lynne plays on that song. And it's really interesting that you can't really hear a Jeff Lynne sound as you can in Traveling Wilburys or George Harrison's Cloud Nine album or even Free as a Bird.

SPEAKER_03: 17:25

Not so much. I mean, I don't know. Did Jeff Lynne produce this? I think he did, didn't he? Okay. I mean, it does have a lot of banks of guitar, which is kind of that sort of solidity of, you know, the acoustics in the background, adding the, you know, just adding the support to the other guitars, the electric. And it's, you know, that's something of the Jeff Lynne sound. It sounds very solid.

SPEAKER_01: 17:51

Yeah, but it doesn't have that very distinctive sound. It doesn't have drums. Yeah, I think because it doesn't

SPEAKER_03: 17:58

have that big snare drum. It doesn't have that. Yeah, that

SPEAKER_01: 18:02

compressed drum sound.

SPEAKER_03: 18:04

By the way, this is an aside, but I wonder if they do remix Free As A Bird this year. Yeah. I wonder if they're going to keep that snare sound or if they're going to like just draw it back a little bit, you know, because it's a really good part. I mean, the opening of Free Your Spirit is wonderful, but I just wonder if they're going to, you know, because it does dominate that track.

SPEAKER_01: 18:27

Yeah, but at the same time, it is Jeff Lynn's baby, that song. I mean, he did so much kind of splitting all the different parts and putting them together that I think it would be unfair if they didn't give him producer's credit. Right, yeah. I think. And I think it was a little bit unfair that he didn't get to produce Now and Then as well.

SPEAKER_03: 18:46

Yeah. Who produced Now and Then? Was that Giles Martin?

SPEAKER_01: 18:48

That was Giles Martin and Paul. And there was a documentary about the life of Jeff Lynne where Paul said, I'm going to talk to Jeff and we're going to finish that song. And obviously, he went with another producer. So I thought that was a little bit unfair.

SPEAKER_03: 19:02

Yeah, well, Jeff's done good work with the... I mean, yeah, Fraser Bird has got a unique... And it is a Jeff Flynn sound, but it's exciting when you hear it. It's got its own kind of sonic palette. Jeff did a good job.

SPEAKER_01: 19:22

I think he did. And I don't really mind that Jeff Flynn drum sound, especially on Free As A Bird, particularly. I'm less fond of Real Love, I have to say. So I wonder what they're going to do with that song.

SPEAKER_03: 19:34

Yeah, I mean, I'm just a huge Yellow fan. I saw them last year, so I'm okay with Jeff Lynne being like another fifth Beatle.

SPEAKER_01: 19:42

He's a great musician, so it makes sense.

SPEAKER_03: 19:44

Yeah, and he's an expert with harmonies, and that's one of the Beatles' strengths as well. And he's a sort of acolyte. I mean, he just loves the Beatles, so he makes a real effort with their stuff.

SPEAKER_01: 19:57

Can you imagine getting that job to produce the Beatles?

SPEAKER_03: 20:01

Oh, yeah, that would be wonderful. Well, I would make it a lot more psychedelic. You know there's some psychedelic interludes in this album, like in The World Tonight, and I would just push the boat out there and say, Paul, do you want to do a bit more of

SPEAKER_01: 20:17

that? Yeah. Right,

SPEAKER_03: 20:19

so next song. Next song, right. I'm going to start at the top. I've ranked all these out of 10, because for a lot of them, it was the first time I've been hearing them, or the first time for a long time, and I don't know the album well, but one of the tracks I did hear, which for me is a 10 out of 10, it's the only 10 out of 10 track for me, is Little Willow. For Maureen Starkey's children, she died of leukemia in 1994 and paul commented on the the veiling of the kind of the subject matter uh rather than writing it with her name in it or something um you know it's called little willow and it's about the fragility of life in paul's words now this is a perfect track it's perfect again we've got the um arpeggios. Is this one of the George Martin productions? I think so. So the distant strings, the sort of the vocal kind of samples, the arrangement here, I wonder if it's George Martin. It's fantastic. This is just a perfect, perfect track. And if somebody one of the top 10 of post-Beatles Paul tracks. This would be one of them, wouldn't it? Yeah, it's a lovely song. And he's never performed it live for some reason.

SPEAKER_01: 21:57

And it's got a very cheesy video as well. I don't know if you saw it on the McCartney Years DVD that was released a few years ago.

SPEAKER_03: 22:04

I noticed it was on YouTube, but I haven't seen it yet.

SPEAKER_01: 22:06

Yeah, it's got like a soap opera kind of 90s feel. Ah, okay. And it was produced actually by McCartney and Jeff Lynne.

SPEAKER_03: 22:16

Ah, okay. And I wonder who did the arrangements for the, you know, the kind of these little accompaniments that come in the background. I mean, maybe that was McCartney and Jeff Lynne as well. I think there was a Mellotron that Paul played.

SPEAKER_01: 22:30

Must

SPEAKER_03: 22:30

have been. Oh, wow. Nice. Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 22:33

Yes. Wow. Yeah. Because in the list of musicians for this, I've got only Paul and Jeff Lynne. And Paul played, well, he did the vocals, backing vocals, acoustic guitar, Spanish guitar, bass, piano, electric guitar, harmonium, harpsichord, mellotron and percussion. And Jeff Lynne.

SPEAKER_03: 22:50

Wow. Can you believe it's got all that stuff in it?

SPEAKER_01: 22:53

I know. I can't hear most of that stuff.

SPEAKER_03: 22:55

I mean, it's got little, the percussion is just little chimes, right? Kind of glockenspiel or something like that. It's a, It's just, this is a triumph, you know, it's a triumph. And I hope that Maureen's kids

SPEAKER_01: 23:09

loved it. Yeah, it's a beautiful song. And it really represents Paul, I think, like 90s Paul. His voice sounds really good. The guitar playing is excellent. It's a simple song, but with a strong message. I really like it. Yeah, yeah. Jeff Lynne played electric spinet and harpsichord. Wow, what's a spinet? I have no idea, actually. But yeah, so he played on a lot of these songs.

SPEAKER_03: 23:39

Yeah, and that was one of the ones when I used to go hoovering up content without paying for it online. The ones that came up from this album were Little Willow and Calico Skies. And both of those are great songs.

SPEAKER_01: 23:56

Yeah, they're great songs. Should we talk about Calico Skies then? Yeah. What do you think of Calico Skies? I think it's one of the best songs on the album. This was produced by George Martin and Paul. And it's just such a beautiful song. Only Paul and his acoustic guitar. Yes,

SPEAKER_03: 24:18

it's a kind of like a Blackbird. It reminds me of Blackbird Arrangement, but I'm not a huge fan of Blackbird. I don't know why. I think this is a fantastic song. Apparently, it was written in 1991 during Hurricane Bob, and there was a power cut, and he wrote it then.

SPEAKER_01: 24:37

Yeah, and then he played a few versions of it, and then I think he plays it two steps down. So if you listen to the demo, it always sounds a bit higher than the finished track. Ah, okay, okay. Or half a step down, actually.

SPEAKER_03: 24:56

Is it partly a love song to Linda? I don't know, you know, I mean, obviously, well, I don't know when they recorded this, what... stage her illness had reached but you know it seems to be very sweet message you know for the rest of my life and everything it kind of chokes me up it's a very sweet lyric

SPEAKER_01: 25:19

yeah it's a beautiful lyric and yeah I think it must have been one of the last songs recorded I know that the last song where Linda participated was Heaven on a Sunday

SPEAKER_03: 25:30

Okay. It's very moving. Like when you realize that this was the last album that they worked on together, that's one of the things that sort of just keeps coming back with several of these songs. And I know this kind of goes into a sort of lyric about soldiers and everything like that. But really, I mean, it starts as a love song. And I'm sure it's to Linda.

SPEAKER_01: 25:55

Yeah, and it's a beautiful song. Quite tricky to play on guitar. I don't know if you've ever tried it, but it's quite tricky.

SPEAKER_03: 26:02

Oh, I bet it is. It sounds tricky. Apparently this was started, finished and mixed in a single session. And they used the earliest recording.

SPEAKER_01: 26:12

And I think, I'd have to double check this, but I think when, what's the name of the last track of McCartney 3? Is it When Winter Comes? Ah, the same session. You're right. Yeah, yeah,

SPEAKER_03: 26:23

yeah, exactly. Yeah, so what I meant was this was the first thing that was recorded for the album. All right, okay. Yeah, but yeah, it is from that same session.

SPEAKER_01: 26:34

Yeah, and both songs are beautiful. I actually can't believe they didn't include When Winter Comes on this album, and they included Used to Be Bad.

SPEAKER_03: 26:44

Yeah, exactly. When Winter Comes is possibly my favourite one on McCartney 3, which is a pretty strong album as well.

SPEAKER_01: 26:52

Yeah. I'll play a bit of Calico Skies.

SPEAKER_03: 26:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 27:05

It was written that I would love you from the moment I opened my eyes and the more So you gave me life on the Gallico skies. I will hold you for as long as you like. I'll hold you for the rest of my life.

SPEAKER_01: 27:39

Right. So can you play this? Yeah, I can play it. Nice. And this is the normal key. This comes from an interview, actually, this version of Calico Skies. Ah, that's the one. Yeah, and it's great. Have a listen.

SPEAKER_02: 27:56

It was written that I would love you From the moment I opened my eyes The song was written during a power cut when I was on holiday in America. And the Hurricane Bob had just roared through.

SPEAKER_01: 28:29

There you go. There you go,

SPEAKER_03: 28:31

Hurricane Bob. I looked that up. That's August 1991. And I can't remember what I was doing in August 1991. But yeah, very long time ago. This is a classic, classic McCartney melody. This could have been a Beatles track. This could easily have been on the White Album.

SPEAKER_01: 28:50

Yeah, definitely. It was recorded in 1992, actually. So it wasn't recorded during the Flaming Pie sessions. And during the same session, When Winter Comes was recorded and Great Day, which is the closing track of this album.

SPEAKER_03: 29:03

Wow. So they just took the recording and they put it on the album. Maybe they cleaned it up or mixed it or something. It's great. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 29:13

Right.

SPEAKER_03: 29:13

Okay. What's next? You choose. Let me see. What else? So many to choose from. How about the single, Young Boy?

SPEAKER_01: 29:30

Yeah, that was the first song I think they recorded for the actual... With Steve Miller. Yeah, with Steve Miller. And actually for this album. What... Yeah, the first songs obviously were the ones from 92, but for this particular project, that was the first song they recorded.

SPEAKER_03: 29:46

Right, and apparently, here's the thing, that they... There was a song, you may know this, but I haven't heard it, with Steve Miller in 1969 that they did together called My Dark Hour. And Paul had listened to it again and kind of this inspired young boy, which I think is a really good single. It reminds me of Hope of Deliverance, which I really love. And I liked it as soon as I heard it. It's kind of breezy and upbeat. It's kind of like traveling Wilbury style. It's Yeah, that's pretty nice. A good choice for the single.

SPEAKER_01: 30:27

Yeah, it's a good single. I'm not sure about the lyrics, though. It's not my favorite lyric, I must say. But I love the tune. It's a great tune.

SPEAKER_03: 30:37

Okay, you have to open up the lyrics to me because I haven't really... I sort of didn't really register. Is it just about a young boy trying to find love? Exactly. Is that his son, maybe? It was about James, maybe?

SPEAKER_01: 30:50

I don't know. But he doesn't need another helping hand from someone. But don't you think he doesn't understand what he wants? Though independence means a lot, he's got to still be strong. He's just a young boy looking for a way to find love. Okay. So find love, a perfect combination. Find love, whatever you do. Find love, a cause for celebration.

SPEAKER_03: 31:11

Yeah, okay, so it's not the strongest lyric ever. It's not his strongest lyric. It's a very catchy song. One thing I noticed on this album is the melodic... He kind of, on several tracks, he's going for a kind of low register vocal. So, like, you're... If You Wanna and The World Tonight and Song We Were Singing and this one, he's kind of singing in that low register that makes me think like he's been listening to stuff like Things We Said Today rather than going for his high sort of regular Paul rock out vocal. He's kind of just reining it in a little bit and I enjoy that. That's where I think You know, like you said, it's a chance to listen to young Paul.

SPEAKER_01: 32:02

Yeah, yeah. It sounds like young Paul. I'll play a bit of it. So yeah, it's a good song.

SPEAKER_03: 32:54

Nice. And then the lead from Steve Miller is great. Kind of twin lead guitar. Reminds me a little bit of My Sweet Lord. I wonder if they were listening to that and kind of referencing it a little bit.

SPEAKER_01: 33:05

Yeah. He did a version of this on TFI Friday. Oh,

SPEAKER_03: 33:11

I didn't see this one, but I saw Flaming Pie on TFI Friday. I must have been watching TV somewhere when I came home. Because at that time, like, you know, there was no internet or something. You had to be there to see the show.

SPEAKER_01: 33:25

Yeah, and it was a very interesting performance because it was Paul on guitar. And then there were a few televisions with Paul playing the other instruments.

SPEAKER_03: 33:35

Oh, so a bit like coming up.

SPEAKER_01: 33:37

Yeah, but with TVs instead of like the special effects. And I remember hearing someone saying that that was a very tacky, or it was thought of as being very tacky at the time. I think it's pretty cool, personally.

SPEAKER_03: 33:49

It's all right. It's okay. You know, like he's done it before. He's doing a different version of it. I remember seeing Flaming Pie and thinking... You know, because like I said, I didn't have the album. Yeah. But I saw Flaming Pine. I thought, you know, that's a pretty good song. And, you know, maybe I should get the album. I didn't have much money at the time. So I didn't give in to temptation. Had it been nowadays, I just would have picked up the album after seeing that performance.

SPEAKER_01: 34:17

Fair enough. But I feel CDs were really expensive at the time. They were.

SPEAKER_03: 34:21

They were like... They were... I'm going to say£15. Something like that. They were pretty expensive.

SPEAKER_01: 34:31

Yeah, they were not cheap. Because I remember having to wait to get this because I didn't have the money and having to save up to

SPEAKER_03: 34:38

buy it. You were 14. Was it one of the first CDs that you ever bought?

SPEAKER_01: 34:44

I think yes. It was right when I started to look after CDs.

SPEAKER_03: 34:51

You must have been thrilled to get it.

SPEAKER_01: 34:53

Yeah, my dad got it for me. Well, he helped me get it because I was saving up and I remember I needed a thousand colonists more to buy it, which sounds like a lot of money, but it wasn't.

SPEAKER_03: 35:05

Wow. So this is your Paul album. That's really interesting. Mine's McCartney too. That was the one that came out when I was, you know, similar age.

SPEAKER_01: 35:14

Yeah. Which is also great. We have to do one episode of McCartney too.

SPEAKER_03: 35:18

Oh yeah, we'll do that one. Yeah, for sure. I know that one like the back of my hand, right? I know every second of that album.

SPEAKER_01: 35:23

And I love it. It's just such a crazy... album i love all the crazy bits which most people don't like

SPEAKER_03: 35:28

yeah we'll

SPEAKER_01: 35:29

do we'll

SPEAKER_03: 35:29

do an episode of that i've got a question before we move on young boy um i think it could be all over by 304 and then it extends it with this kind of slowed pace i think that's an editorial mistake i think they should have chopped it i mean it sounds like a beatles track kind of and three minutes i think they should have just chopped it you know i don't think the coda adds a lot

SPEAKER_01: 35:57

yeah i agree i don't think unlike the songs we were singing where it just gets more exciting i think it just gets it just loses um the power that the song starts with

SPEAKER_03: 36:09

Yeah. And also, you know, I think because this album's got such a nice Beatles-y feel, it's got some really short tracks, and it's got 14 tracks, right? So there's all these little Beatles references, and I think they should have just chopped

SPEAKER_01: 36:22

it. I wonder if the young boy found the way to love someone so he got all disappointed or something. Oh, I think...

SPEAKER_03: 36:30

No. I think he found what he was looking for. I mean, you know. Yeah, so he's like, ugh. As... As has been said, it's been said on other podcasts, but Paul's just such a believer in love and romance and its power to transform people. Not that he really gets preachy about it, but it's suffused through all his songs, right? I mean, if there's a theme to Paul McCartney's songs, it's just like, love is going to find a way.

SPEAKER_01: 37:00

Yeah, that's true. That's true. Yeah. Right. Next song. Should we go for one of the weaker songs, perhaps?

SPEAKER_03: 37:08

If you do, I may not. It's possible that I haven't heard it because I missed out two tracks from this album because I couldn't listen to them. You can guess what they were.

SPEAKER_01: 37:19

I'm going to guess one of them was Really Love You. Yes. Yeah. And the other one might be Used To Be Bad.

SPEAKER_03: 37:26

That's right. So I couldn't listen to them. They were just too ordinary.

SPEAKER_01: 37:32

Yeah, I guess the only interesting thing about Really Love You is the fact that Ringo plays.

SPEAKER_03: 37:36

Yeah, but, you know, it's just so long and it just goes on and on forever.

SPEAKER_01: 37:41

And it's just nonsense as well.

SPEAKER_03: 37:44

It's not like me to be critical. Sorry, Paul. But, you know, I love the rest of the album.

SPEAKER_01: 37:52

And here is the thing. It could have been such a perfect album if he had included other things that he had, that he had already recorded. And still he chose to include those two songs. I

SPEAKER_03: 38:03

think it's because it's with Ringo and with Steve and Miller and with his friends and all of that. I think that's why.

SPEAKER_01: 38:10

Yeah, but there was another one called Broomstick, which I think was a B-side. There was another one called Love Come Tumbling Down. And another one called Same Love. And I think those three songs are much stronger. And When Winter Comes, which was released recently, but it was recorded back in 92. Those would have been... Well, actually, When Winter Comes would have even fit within kind of the theme of the album, you

SPEAKER_03: 38:35

know? That would have been... that would be another great job, wouldn't it? Being given, you know, the job of sort of sequencing and editing the track lists on these albums, you know, like, cause I often think I would have combined, uh, I mean, this is off topic, but combined Memory Almost Full and Chaos and Creation, if I could have just combined those into a single album, it would be a timeless classic. And had it produced by Nigel Godridge. Yeah, we got like two really kind of pretty good albums, but, you know, like I just think, wait, wait, and then just pick 12 or 14 amazing songs.

SPEAKER_01: 39:17

Yeah, but I believe that a lot of the songs from Memory Almost Full were... not liked by Nigel Godridge, which is why apparently he refused to record any songs he didn't like.

SPEAKER_03: 39:27

Paul's got to take back control, you know. Yeah. But, you know, I mean, they're all good, but I just think, wow, you know, that could have been a wonderful single album. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 39:41

It's true. But, yeah, I think they made a mistake with those songs. There's another song, which I think it was released as a B-side, wasn't it? It's called Looking For You And that one is, I think, from the same session.

SPEAKER_03: 39:56

Let's hear a bit of it because I don't have the box set. I've got the double CD version with the bonus audio. So I don't know, looking for you.

SPEAKER_01: 40:05

Okay, I'll play looking for you.

UNKNOWN: 40:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 41:04

You could even argue that this song is better than Really Love You.

SPEAKER_03: 41:07

Yeah, it's not bad. Sometimes I think he, again, maybe perhaps backs away from the slightly edgier stuff, you know, slightly more experimental stuff. And he sort of, but, you know, I think he's learned over the years not to and to kind of respect those kind of, weirder sounding tracks and, you know, because people really like them.

SPEAKER_01: 41:32

Yeah. This is Broomstick. I don't know if you've heard Broomstick. This is with Stephen. No, I

SPEAKER_03: 41:36

haven't.

SPEAKER_01: 41:36

Okay, one sec. So there you

SPEAKER_03: 42:25

go. Yeah, that's good. I like that. Yeah, I like that too.

SPEAKER_01: 42:28

Yeah, and it was recorded in the same session as Used to be Bad. Okay. Yeah, with Steve

SPEAKER_03: 42:34

Miller. Used to be Bad, I can't comment on. So let's go and we'll talk about one another. It's Used to be Bad and it still is. Wow, yeah. Texas blues, that was supposed to be. But Used to be Bad is followed by... A souvenir. Now, I give this one 7 or 7.5 out of 10. I like this one. This one kind of sneaked up on me to start with. I thought, oh, no, here's another kind of bluesy sort of song. But the chord sequence, you can go and listen to the demo. It's got a lovely chord sequence. The riff that kind of comes up, the electric riff is great. I think that's a real piece of inspiration. It really makes the song. track and he it says somewhere that Paul wanted to I think this is from the Beatles Bible that he wanted to replicate the easy easy laid-back sound of the original demo and and he really does and and and of course it's got that nice coda at the end with the crackle. It's cool. I really like this one.

SPEAKER_01: 43:50

Yeah, it's true. He wanted to get the same vibe that he got from the demo to the point that they used the demo as the guiding track.

SPEAKER_03: 43:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 43:58

And he said he really liked the fact that it was so atmospheric that you could hear a storm and you could hear a phone ringing. Yeah. And it really is if you listen to it. I actually got to like the song much more once I heard the demo.

SPEAKER_03: 44:12

Yeah, I like the demo with the phone. I wonder how many times it's going to ring before he answers it. I think it just rings twice.

SPEAKER_01: 44:20

Yeah. I'll play a bit of the demo. Oh, sorry. That's some days. That's not Souvenir Hugo. So, yes, it's beautiful. You know what happened? When I listened to it a couple of weeks ago, that phone noise, the ring, it reminded me so much of when I was a kid, you know, because phones don't sound like that

SPEAKER_03: 45:36

anymore. No, I mean, no, you don't hear that noise at all. I love the fact that he's sitting there. Not only not answering the phone, but the fact that he's into his first syllable. And he just carries on. He obviously makes that split-second decision that that's not an important call.

SPEAKER_01: 45:58

Can you imagine if that person had called again? Come on, man. You just ruined the perfect take.

SPEAKER_03: 46:05

Yeah, yeah. I'd love to have this sound sampler key fob. that the engineer had. This is how they got this crackle from the vinyl disc, apparently. Oh, really? Yeah, the engineer, John Jacobs, had a sound sampler key fob. And I've just been wondering, what's that? I would really like one of those. Of course, we can do it on our phones now

SPEAKER_04: 46:31

and

SPEAKER_03: 46:33

away. Yeah, you can hear when he's playing along there, you can hear he's already got the riff in mind. That's what I like about hearing these demo versions the writer I mean we've talked about it before but in this case he's already got that riff in his mind because he's playing it there on the guitar you know so he kind of knows something about the arrangement already

SPEAKER_01: 46:56

yeah I'll play a bit of the original song or the song that ended up on the album

SPEAKER_02: 47:02

when you're fed up shedding too many tears and your memories seem like just so many Welcome to you

SPEAKER_01: 47:38

So it's really nice. And then the last bit, the bit you were talking about, let's see if we can get it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 47:45

Oh, I love those kind of eccentric codas and everything. I thought, you know, one day we could do a whole podcast on just those little bits.

SPEAKER_01: 48:05

Definitely, yeah. You know something? Now that you were talking about the demos, I wonder whether they're going to kind of reinvent the archive collection. Because it's been that it usually has the original album plus the demos or whatever he's done from the time or the singles. But I really like the approach that the John Lennon camp took. to have the original album and then have the stripped-down versions and then the elements versions. So I really like that approach. Oh,

SPEAKER_03: 48:35

yeah. I mean, that's kind of opening the whole book, isn't it? You'd really have to... I mean, that's really for completists only, isn't it? The only one I've actually got of that is the Plastic Uno band.

SPEAKER_04: 48:47

Yeah,

SPEAKER_03: 48:47

and it's great. Yeah, no, it's really great. I think for a classic... album for a wonderful album, then it's nice to be able to dig deep. And not all the albums would merit that.

SPEAKER_01: 49:01

No, maybe not all the albums. But in the case of Pulse, I guess most of the Wings albums would.

SPEAKER_03: 49:07

Yeah, I mean, I don't... They could be a market for a sort of very limited edition. I guess you don't want to release thousands of those things they might not

SPEAKER_01: 49:17

sell. Yeah, it's getting a bit crazy. Do you see they're going to release the half-speed remaster of Venus in Mass?

SPEAKER_03: 49:24

Well, of course they're going to release them all in the half-speed masters, except for the ones

SPEAKER_01: 49:30

we won. Except for London Town and Back to the Egg.

SPEAKER_03: 49:34

Yeah, fans love those albums. I read somewhere that we're going to have to wait until 2028. I mean, if we're still around, in 2028 is the 50th anniversary of London Town.

SPEAKER_01: 49:48

No, I don't think so. They'll release them before. I just hope that they pick up the archive collection. It's just crazy that it started 25 years ago and they still haven't completed it.

SPEAKER_03: 49:58

No. Oh, I'll bet you a thousand of those things.

SPEAKER_01: 50:02

And I feel so bad about the fact that I've been collecting all these albums and I'll never have a complete collection.

SPEAKER_03: 50:11

Oh, well, yeah. There you go. You just have to console yourself. I mean, who knows? I mean, there's enough call for it. There's enough demand. I mean, for a limited release, and he's got enough fans, they could definitely do a limited pressing. Like they've done with these Japanese presses. Yes, exactly, yeah. Maybe. Oh, we've got to, we've definitely got to, got to, got to talk about Some Days. We do, yes. And Flaming Pie as well, got to talk about. So anyway, Some Days, I think this is, this was supposedly written during one of Linda's cookery assignments, a kind of two hours, write a song challenge.

UNKNOWN: 50:53

Yes.

SPEAKER_03: 50:54

I love this. This is where the album starts really hitting a peak for me. It reminds me a little bit of Love and Song. Again, it's got the arpeggios, it's got the strings, the harpsichords. Is it an oboe? This is a George Martin arrangement. The oboe is just absolutely lovely. I thought it was a clarinet, but absolutely beautiful. Fantastic. And this is a George Martin production, isn't

SPEAKER_01: 51:19

it? It is, yes. And it's a great production. It's a beautiful song. Again, it's a song that has a very strange structure because it's so repetitive, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03: 51:31

Yeah, and it's got a little play. There's a kind of play with the timing in the middle eight. There's a missed bar, which is a very Beatles trick. You get that in All You Need Is Love and so on. I love... one of the things i like with this album is musically he's being a little bit unpredictable playing with the time and playing with the number of bars or the beats in the bar i like that

SPEAKER_01: 51:59

so that's paul's way of turning what would normally be a simple song into a more complex song

SPEAKER_03: 52:04

yes maybe and then i also like his is his own spanish solo echoed you know either i think probably played twice or else delayed but i bet he played it twice um it reminds me of one of these days when you've got the little acoustics playing off each other in the different earphones i think it's a real touch of genius i i'm glad he brought it back for a second time this uh solo with the spanish guitar i love

SPEAKER_01: 52:33

it yeah it's a very good solo i don't know whether he played it twice because if he did i mean they sound perfect

SPEAKER_03: 52:39

Yeah, they sound, I mean, they're absolute matches. And I suppose in the Beatles days, they would have done it twice. And now you could just do it with like cut and paste, copy and paste.

SPEAKER_01: 52:49

Yeah. I'll play a bit of the song.

SPEAKER_02: 53:03

Some days I look, I look at you with eyes that shine. I don't believe that you were mine It's no good asking me what time of day it is Who won the match or scored the goal Some days I look, some days I look into your soul Oh

SPEAKER_03: 53:48

yeah, I love that harp there. That happens more than once on this album and reminds me a little bit of Strawberry Fields. And

SPEAKER_01: 54:00

it's one of those things like the song is so repetitive and those are the little bits that make it not boring.

SPEAKER_03: 54:06

Yes, yeah. I think the arrangement is really good. I'm glad that George Martin did it. And I love that line It's no good asking me who won the match or scored the goal because I'm like that too. I never know who scored the goal because it kind of doesn't really matter.

SPEAKER_01: 54:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 54:26

Only to the person who did it. Yeah. I mean, if you follow those things. Again, names of actors. I'm just not very good at remembering it. So it's just a nice little line. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 54:40

A great song, I think. That's another one of the songs that that guy in the other podcast said it's a song that he thinks he's supposed to like, but he doesn't quite get. Oh, no,

SPEAKER_03: 54:51

I think this is a lovely melody. I

SPEAKER_01: 54:54

disagree. I like this straight away. Next song, you said Some Days Then...

SPEAKER_03: 55:02

Well, we've got quite a lot of good ones. We've got Flaming Pie. We've got Beautiful Night, which obviously is a big single. Yeah,

SPEAKER_01: 55:11

it was a single. And Great Day as well. And also we have In the World Tonight, which was the first single.

SPEAKER_03: 55:18

Wow.

SPEAKER_01: 55:19

Wow, we've hardly talked about these songs. Well, so

SPEAKER_03: 55:22

two or three minutes each. I'm going to start with, because I can't leave it out, Great Day. I think... written in 1970 and sung to their children. Linda's on it. very sad because it's the last track she's on it she's singing it won't be long it reminds me very much of you know who's that coming around that corner on ram and on big barn bed um this was taped on the same day as calico skies when when it comes and and it has that in it and it has that sort of coda effect of her majesty at the end of the album i think that's a wonderful end you know that's why it's such a satisfying album we've got a nice opener we've What a lovely ending.

SPEAKER_01: 56:09

Yeah, he played a bit of it actually in 1974 when he did the backyard sessions that were recently shown in the cinema as part of One Hand Clapping. And you can see him going and trying the introduction in between songs. So you can tell, as you said, that the song was written in the 70s, in the early 70s.

SPEAKER_03: 56:32

A lovely one to finish with. And it's so nice that Linda's on it. You know, I'm repeating myself, but that's kind of, it's a very moving ending to the album. And I prefer it to Beautiful Night,

SPEAKER_01: 56:44

actually. Yeah. I like them equally because they're different. They're very different songs, actually. Great Day is such a simple song, just acoustic guitar, and Beautiful Night is such a big orchestrated production that I just feel that they're so different. But I love them both. I think they're really good. I like And I Have a Soft Spot for Heaven on a Sunday, just because that's the last song that Linda sang on.

SPEAKER_03: 57:13

Yeah, and also with James McCartney on this one, on electric guitar. The entry of the electric guitar is really good. I thought, who's that? You know, because it's obviously not Paul with that very heavy sound. And then they're jamming together and it's really fun.

SPEAKER_01: 57:30

Yeah, it's a great song as well. I don't know whether it belongs on this album. because everything else is so kind of acoustic, and then you have Heaven on a Sunday, which you can tell has a kind of different approach. But it's such a catchy song. Yeah, and again, this

SPEAKER_03: 57:49

playing with the timing and the bar length, I think it's in the middle eight. Again, just pushing the boat out a little bit, Beatles-like.

SPEAKER_01: 57:59

Yeah, for sure. Should I play a bit of it? Yeah. Well, I play a bit of both songs. Great day first. And then I'm having it on Sunday. So great day. So that's Great Day and here is Heaven on a Sunday.

SPEAKER_02: 59:28

So

SPEAKER_01: 59:36

yeah, there's a video on YouTube where you can see Paul and Linda singing together and it's quite touching.

SPEAKER_03: 59:45

Oh, nice. This is the bit where they're playing with the time. If you only had one love. Use it, be the one I choose. So I like the musical vocabulary to say what they're doing there with the bar length, but you can see that it's not quite conventional.

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:03

Yeah, but it makes it very catchy at the same time.

SPEAKER_03: 1:00:06

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:09

And Flaming Pie.

SPEAKER_03: 1:00:11

Yes, Flaming Pie. What do you think of Flaming Pie?

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:13

Well, it's not my favourite song of the album, I must say. It's got a Lady Madonna vibe. there yeah and

SPEAKER_03: 1:00:20

also like kind of i'm thinking of like monkbury moon delight and when the night

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:25

and those kind

SPEAKER_03: 1:00:26

of those kind of songs like that

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:28

yes um he does that voice yes um i like the like after the verse or after the chorus sorry he does like a little piano solo thing which i like um and and he played this song live i think it was a it was a single so he played it live um when we're whatever he went to present the album on talk shows and things.

SPEAKER_03: 1:00:47

Yes, yeah. So it's obviously nice and easy to play. I like that when the lead guitar comes in, I like the kind of supporting riff in the background, which kind of reminds me of Lady Madonna, you know, the piano going with the electric guitars in the background. Sounds again like a Jeff Lynne production. It is, yes. It

SPEAKER_01: 1:01:04

is a Jeff Lynne

SPEAKER_03: 1:01:05

production. Really good. Recorded in a four-hour deadline, Beatles style. So just like, you know, ramming it down and just getting... Getting it done. And with a live vocal, which they kept.

SPEAKER_01: 1:01:18

Yeah, yeah. And it sounds great. As you said, I love the guitar solo. He uses his Epiphone Casino for that solo as well. You can tell because that guitar sounds really good. Okay. And that's what I meant from before, that even though you have Paul playing the drums, it doesn't have that Jeff Lynne drum sound, or at least not as noticeable. Right, yeah. Because I guess

SPEAKER_03: 1:01:41

everything's... Right, everything's kind of balanced in this one, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:01:45

Yeah. Sorry, I'll play a bit of the song. Yeah, go ahead.

UNKNOWN: 1:01:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 1:02:34

It's got a groove, that.

SPEAKER_01: 1:02:37

It does, yeah, but it's got nonsensical lyrics. Deliberately so. Yeah, yeah,

SPEAKER_03: 1:02:42

deliberately. Yeah, yeah. And do you know how long it is? Check it out. It's like three minutes or something. I think it comes in around three minutes, so it's got that real Beatles, you know, now it's here, now it's gone. Yeah. You know, it doesn't outstay its welcome. It's two minutes thirty. Isn't that amazing? Yeah, like some of the old Beatles songs. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:03:07

Yeah. Something funny happened. Now you talk about Beatles songs. I was in a supermarket until There Was You was playing. Yeah. So I recognized the solo. And then I couldn't hear Paul. And then I was thinking, that's just because of that weird stereo separation they did.

SPEAKER_03: 1:03:20

If you run to the other side of the

SPEAKER_01: 1:03:22

supermarket,

SPEAKER_03: 1:03:25

then you'll hear it, but the song will be over.

SPEAKER_01: 1:03:27

Yeah, well, and you won't be able to hear the guitar. It's just the vocal.

SPEAKER_03: 1:03:31

Yeah. We've got two more to do. I think we should do them both. We're running over time, but we can. So, Beautiful Night. i've tried hard to like this one it's okay it's very nice and optimistic and i like that george martin produced it it's not my favorite and i want to say that this is the first time the only time i know where paul mccartney stole a hook line the um so that you know make it a beautiful night for me uh which is the main hook I can't exactly pin it down, but it could be Elton John, Goodbye Yellow Brick Road. It's definitely very 70s, and that might be it. I know that it wasn't deliberate. And please don't sue me. I would never suggest that it be deliberate. But it is like it's somebody else's melody line. It sounds like somebody else. And it's a great line, but it's just so unusual for Paul to do that. Even if it was subconscious. Unconsciously, even unconsciously. It just sounds like, I think it's goodbye, Yellow Brick Road, when it goes... Yeah, anyway, there you go. It's okay. Like, I give it a 5.5 or maybe a 6 out of

SPEAKER_01: 1:04:48

10. Wow, I'd give it an 8. Ah, there you go. Well, tell me about it. Well, I just like it. It's just a typical kind of... It reminds me, especially at the beginning of Let It Be, that kind of Let It Be vibe with the piano. And then the way the orchestra comes in, very George Martin. So I really like it. And he did a demo in the 90s that didn't... Well, in the... mid-90s, was it in the 80s? I've got a 1995 demo here and he did one I think in 1987 as part of the Return to Pepperland.

SPEAKER_03: 1:05:22

Wow, let's hear one of the demos, that'd be interesting.

SPEAKER_01: 1:05:24

And there is also a run-through that he does with Ringo, which is very interesting. I'll play you the run-through first.

SPEAKER_03: 1:05:29

Okay.

SPEAKER_02: 1:05:30

Let's just try it through, see if this length and stuff is going to work, yeah? Okay.

SPEAKER_03: 1:05:39

I'm going to just come in at the top, even though I know on the real record I'll come in the second

SPEAKER_02: 1:05:44

one. Just

SPEAKER_03: 1:05:44

so I can

SPEAKER_02: 1:05:45

get into it. Yeah, okay. Two, three, and a bit. Some boats gone out fishing Some boats high and dry Some boats on a mission To the lonely long line Some folks got a vision Of a castle in the sky

SPEAKER_01: 1:06:13

That's the run-through. Here's the demo. Right.

SPEAKER_02: 1:06:17

Some boats gone out fishing. Some boats high and dry. Some boats on a mission to the lonely lower line. Some folk got a vision of a castle in the sky. And I'm left stranded.

SPEAKER_01: 1:06:44

And this is the 80s version. Wow. Just one second.

SPEAKER_02: 1:07:02

Some boats gonna have fishing Some boats high and dry Some boats on mission Some folks got a vision of a castle in the sky And I'm left stranded, wondering why

SPEAKER_01: 1:07:30

And the one on the record. They nailed it. Yeah, they did. It's much better than the one on the record.

SPEAKER_02: 1:07:53

So yeah,

SPEAKER_01: 1:08:08

so there you go.

SPEAKER_03: 1:08:11

They obviously had a conversation about reverb. Yes, definitely. You know, trying to sort of pin it down and they went for the kind of...

SPEAKER_01: 1:08:21

No reverb version. No

SPEAKER_03: 1:08:22

reverb, just very basic version, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:08:25

Yeah, which I like better. I actually don't think reverb works with this song. Actually, the one with reverb reminds me very much of Only Love Remains from Press to

SPEAKER_03: 1:08:32

Play. Right, yeah. I like... I mean... It's okay, I very much like it. At the end they're having so much fun and then Ringo goes, I love when he says, on your way now, you know. Yeah. That's very beatly and sweet, you know.

SPEAKER_01: 1:08:50

The album could have finished there. So I always feel like Great Day was a last minute addition.

SPEAKER_03: 1:08:57

Great Day's Her Majesty. Yes, yes. The end of the album is Beautiful Night and then there's that little... you know tag

SPEAKER_01: 1:09:06

little surprise for the listener

SPEAKER_03: 1:09:08

lovely lovely how Paul does that

SPEAKER_01: 1:09:11

yeah and I think the only song we have left now apart from If You Wanna which we can skip is The World Tonight yes

SPEAKER_03: 1:09:22

yeah so World Tonight is I think it's quite fun. It's not my favorite. I love the psychedelic break with the arpeggios. And I would say, Paul, do more of that. Like, it's really good. I love when he gets experimental. I also like the, I think other people have commented a lot on this, this nice line. I go back so far. I'm in front of me. That's a very nice line from Paul. I mean, we all know what he means.

SPEAKER_01: 1:09:53

Yeah. I like very much his harmonies because he's singing, he double tracks himself, but singing high and singing low at the same time. And I think that works really well. And I like the riff. The riff is really good.

SPEAKER_03: 1:10:08

Yeah, and it's got those, again, those kind of low... low register sort of matter of fact vocals so not a very jumping melody but quite a you know a kind of a flatter melody which was reminiscent of some of the Beatles things

SPEAKER_01: 1:10:24

yeah so you're sitting at the center of a circle yeah

SPEAKER_03: 1:10:28

yes yeah exactly you know so like um again makes me think of things we said today which just because that's such a powerful entry in the middle eight um but you know there's no huge melodic jumps you know

SPEAKER_01: 1:10:44

i'll play a bit of it

SPEAKER_03: 1:10:51

a great beginning yeah great beginning i

SPEAKER_02: 1:10:59

saw you sitting at the center of a circle everybody Everybody wanted something from you I saw you sitting there I saw you swaying to the rhythm of the music Caught you playing Caught you praying to the voice inside you I saw you swaying there I don't care what you wanna be

SPEAKER_03: 1:11:39

There you go. Nice. That's got to be a Jeff Flynn production. It was. Yes, it was. Yeah, okay. Yeah, sounds like it. Yeah. Yeah, so overall, very nice album. I'm sorry I missed it for 23 years. It's definitely one I'll return to. The freshness of it, it's... Well, I mean, it's definitely his best album of the 90s. I have to say that because I don't know Off the Ground and I don't know Driving Rain. So this is Paul in the 90s for

SPEAKER_01: 1:12:12

me. I think it is the best of Paul in the 90s as well. It's better than Off the Ground. It's better than Run Devil Run. Well, I don't know whether you can compare it with Run Devil Run, it being a covers album. And Driving Rain, I don't think it's his strongest album by any means. So I think it's a peak for Paul. And as I said, it's the end of young Paul. That's all fair, isn't

SPEAKER_04: 1:12:38

it?

SPEAKER_03: 1:12:39

it's him moving on it's him transitioning to another stage I mean there's not a lot of wasted space on this album he is really trying with all the time changes all the arpeggios the arrangements sound really nice so it sounds very fresh it sounds very unforced it's nice to hear Paul on the drums and it's nice to hear him playing with other people I'd like to listen to more of the demos actually because I don't know them so well

SPEAKER_01: 1:13:08

yeah I'd like to get the vibe It's one of those I don't have on vinyl. I do. I have off the ground and I don't have this one, which is crazy.

SPEAKER_03: 1:13:16

Yeah, it's quite pricey. It is. You can still get the two-disc version.

SPEAKER_01: 1:13:21

Yeah. And there is a three-disc version, which is even pricier than the two-disc version. But yeah, I'll wait until it goes down in price if it ever does.

SPEAKER_03: 1:13:32

Start saving up.

UNKNOWN: 1:13:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 1:13:35

Great to talk to you again, Bernie. Yeah, likewise. And we will get together soon and we'll do another one.

SPEAKER_01: 1:13:42

Yeah, great. And it was fun to go back to this album, actually. I hadn't heard it in a while, so it was good to come back to it.

SPEAKER_03: 1:13:49

It's fun for me to get to know it, you know, because really it was like coming and getting to know it for the first time. That was a real pleasure.

SPEAKER_01: 1:13:56

Yeah. Anyways, we'll be back soon, right, with another album?

SPEAKER_03: 1:14:02

Yes. Thanks for listening, everybody. Bye-bye.

SPEAKER_01: 1:14:05

Bye.

SPEAKER_02: 1:14:11

OK, thanks for sharing the last hour with us. We'll see you next week. Take care and mind how you go. Bye-bye.